my invisible text
Categories
  • TIMELINE

Help with new pc or Mac specification..

<<

User avatar

Premium Member
Premium Member

Posts: 8534

Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2005 10:43 am

Country: United Kingdom (uk)




Post Tue Jul 18, 2017 12:45 pm

Help with new pc or Mac specification..

Hi all,
It has recently dawned on me, following icreasingly frustrating situations that my 'future-proofed' pc is now an antique, it had32 bit quad 2.6ghz processors, a whopping 3gb ram (!), 2x 500gb HDD and top end Nvidia graphics, but at 8yrs old (or more!) it's now not keeping up, I want to upgrade to the new corel which has a min requirement of 64bit and so on..

Researching new pc's... Speaking to the local shops they all want to sell me their 'top end gaming machine', yes it has all the high st. high spec stuff but it's aimed at gamers with more expendable than sense. trying to do my own research is tough as every reviewer seems to contradict the previous review, so I took to looking at a few companies that to the refub pc's, mainly the high end corporate stuff that's a max 2-3yrs old..

I've found an HP Z series CAD workstation, it runs an intel Xeon (4 or 6 core i think) E5-2643 3.30/3.50 GHz cpu, 32gb ddr3 ram, 240gb SSD, 1TB HDD, Nvidia Quadro 4000 2gb graphics card, 800w psu and win10 pro. it's around the £600 mark, though I can go for a higher spec at about £8-900, does this sound a good buy? the rrp on these machines starts at £2.5 - 3k! Investing that much currently is not really a road I want to go down, though am I better off getting a lower spec 'new' pc, or taking a chance with a warrented hi-spec machine?
Last edited by Hugh Potter on Wed Jul 19, 2017 11:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
<<

5 Star Contributor

Posts: 1138

Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2007 8:57 pm





Post Tue Jul 18, 2017 1:38 pm

Re: Help with new pc specification..

That's pretty serious power for £600. Is that from somewhere reputable?
<<

User avatar

Premium Member
Premium Member

Posts: 8534

Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2005 10:43 am

Country: United Kingdom (uk)




Post Tue Jul 18, 2017 2:32 pm

Re: Help with new pc specification..

Jon Marshall wrote:That's pretty serious power for £600. Is that from somewhere reputable?


from what I can make out they are. I guess they're one of these co's that takes corporate pc's that are px'd when new systems are installed. I'll look into them a little more, the pc would come with a 3 month warranty. The Nvidia Quadro graphics card is £2k+ when new - real high end. It's a couple of years old now (2015 I think) but stil higher spec than I can currently justify buying new!
<<

User avatar

Premium Member
Premium Member

Posts: 8534

Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2005 10:43 am

Country: United Kingdom (uk)




Post Wed Jul 19, 2017 11:16 am

Re: Help with new pc specification..

Ok, so now the wife is saying "for not a lot more money you can go with a mac"!!

any reccomendations for where to look re a mac pricing / spec?

My concerns really are that My onyx rip doesn't seem to support mac os. nor does is support win10 - though this is because win10 wasn't out when my ripcentre (onyx 11?) was released.

Also, large, quality pc screens are relatively inexpensive, I think mac is going to be way off a new budget.

any thoughts welcome.
<<

Premium Member
Premium Member

Posts: 219

Joined: Wed Mar 18, 2015 9:22 am

Country: United Kingdom (uk)




Post Wed Jul 19, 2017 11:46 am

Re: Help with new pc or Mac specification..

Hi Hugh

My business starting in commercial print and design. I am a huge fan of macs, been using them since they first appeared.
If you want the computer for design and artwork then I would say mac all the way. If you want to use the computer as a RIP then PC is the better option.
This is just my opinion, we have four macs on one pc and I only bought the pc to run versaworks.
<<

Premium Member
Premium Member

Posts: 219

Joined: Wed Mar 18, 2015 9:22 am

Country: United Kingdom (uk)




Post Wed Jul 19, 2017 11:49 am

Re: Help with new pc or Mac specification..

Forgot to mention, 600 quid will only get you a second hand mac that is over 5 years old, you could also look at a Mac Mini, but then you need a screen.
<<

User avatar

Premium Member
Premium Member

Posts: 8534

Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2005 10:43 am

Country: United Kingdom (uk)




Post Wed Jul 19, 2017 12:09 pm

Re: Help with new pc or Mac specification..

thanks Mike,
I could keep the old pc as a rip machine and for running a few older programs. my onyx won't run on mac.

The budget has probably changed now. initially I was going to dip into the rainy day fund and the £6-900 budget found the pc spec above. Last night the wife suggested looking at buying a mac (say over 2yrs) and keeping the rainy day funds.

I've been chatting to a good friend on messenger just now, he runs a mac with a split disc so can boot up in windows (bootcamp I think it's called), I can probably run coreldraw x8 / onyx on this, I can't update on current pc as it's on 32bit.

My other concerns with mac are...

the screen costs, being a little ocd I'd like a pair of screens that look the same - another 5k monitor will probably make this unfeasible. I cannot work without two screens any more, infact I want a 3rd, or even a 4th sometimes!

also unless very high end, the storage isn't great, I can't rely on cloud as our broadband is appalling (we're on the furthest end of the copper from the exchange) and would take a lifetime to upload / download files all the time.
<<

User avatar

Premium Member
Premium Member

Posts: 1654

Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2006 12:04 am

Country: United Kingdom (uk)




Post Wed Jul 19, 2017 1:24 pm

Re: Help with new pc or Mac specification..

Although I use Macs for everything except the RIP, I'd probably advise you to stick with PC. If you run in Bootcamp,
you won't be able to access the Mac, so it kind of defeats the object, as you would need it permanently booted as
a PC to run your RIP & CorelDraw. You could use something like Parallels, but I'm not sure how it would run performance
wise.
<<

User avatar

2 Star Contributor

Posts: 170

Joined: Tue Jun 16, 2015 3:19 pm

Country: United Kingdom (uk)




Post Wed Jul 19, 2017 2:17 pm

Re: Help with new pc or Mac specification..

If your software is highly dependent on Windows, then go for a PC. Or get a Mac+Adobe to do the work and keep the PC for RIP and odd Corel stuff if it's still running decent.

It's not worth the hassle with Bootcamp or Parallel on Mac because they cost money and in a few years will not support your software (Corel, RIP, Windows) anymore.
A decent iMac can run smooth macOS and Windows on Parallel so performance is not an issue, it's just the hassle with the software virtualization.

I've got my refurbished iMac from Apple many years ago, good value, 1year warranty. I replaced the HDD with SSD in the meantime and it doesn't miss a beat: https://www.apple.com/uk/shop/browse/ho ... s/mac/imac

For PC, I know Dell has good computers for RIP and design software, I think they are called Precision. The new ones most likely come with Win 10 but you should be able to find some second hand ones with an older version of Windows.
<<

User avatar

Premium Member
Premium Member

Posts: 8340

Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2002 1:00 am





Post Thu Jul 20, 2017 3:17 am

Re: Help with new pc or Mac specification..

Switching your old pc from 32 bit to 64 bit is easy enough & you can probably find a couple of cheap memory sticks to boost your meagre 3gb ram :lol: :lol:
How well that handles the new version of Corel really depends on what sort of work you are doing Hugh, that option would probably cost you less than a meal out for you & the wife so keeps the rainy day money totally safe :lol:
<<

User avatar

Premium Member
Premium Member

Posts: 8534

Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2005 10:43 am

Country: United Kingdom (uk)




Post Thu Jul 20, 2017 9:18 am

Re: Help with new pc or Mac specification..

Thanks everyone. Having spoken to a number of people now, I think I'll stick with pc. While I could upgrade this pc I'm thinking i'd rather buy a new or newer machine, the motherboard was top of the range but is now 8yrs old and better boards are now available, I could also upgrade the graphics etc. The pc currently has 8gb of ram but XP pro can only manage 3gb, I also have a win7 pro disc / code so may install that to utilise more of the ram. also take off hundreds of gb of data / photo's / mp3 / work files to ease the disc space etc. This can then become the rip pc.

thanks again.
Hugh
<<

User avatar

Premium Member
Premium Member

Posts: 8340

Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2002 1:00 am





Post Thu Jul 20, 2017 11:21 am

Re: Help with new pc or Mac specification..

Hugh if your widows 7 disk is 64 bit then switching from windows xp to windows 7 is a no brainier, at the moment your PC has about 3.5gb ram, may be 8 installed but 32 bit operating systems can only access about 3.5 so that's all you really have. That change alone will show you a huge improvement, Throw another 8 gb in it & you have an old but very usable machine.
If you need to run windows XP for old software reasons then you can run windows XP as a virtual machine on the same computer which will allow you to continue to use that software. Windows 7 pro actually has a virtual machine but its a separate download from microsoft. I use Vmware player rather than the microsoft virtual machine but there is a free version which works fine if your only running a single virtual computer :lol:

If your windows 7 disk is 32 bit then go on ebay & buy a windows 7 64 bit recovery disk, you will get one for a few quid & the windows 7 licence you have covers both 32 bit & 64 bit operating systems.

Oh almost forgot, it's not XP that can only manage 3gb ram it is the 32 bit operating system, if you really wanted to stick with XP then you could just get a windows XP pro 64 bit disk, only problem doing it that way is as XP is no longer supported by microsoft then updating all your drivers may cause you problems :lol:
<<

User avatar

Premium Member
Premium Member

Posts: 8534

Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2005 10:43 am

Country: United Kingdom (uk)




Post Thu Jul 20, 2017 11:51 am

Re: Help with new pc or Mac specification..

Thanks Martin. I'm not sure if win7pro is 32 or 64 bit, can't remember. Nothing I now have (or really need) has to be on XP pro, most of my annoying issues seem to have begun since they stopped supporting xp, up until then the few niggles were acceptable!

I'll speak to my puter shop about a 64bit cpu for my motherboard, my main issue is that I can't really operate without a pc, so tempted to buy a new one and then upgrade the old as a back-up once running happily.
<<

User avatar

Premium Member
Premium Member

Posts: 8340

Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2002 1:00 am





Post Thu Jul 20, 2017 12:42 pm

Re: Help with new pc or Mac specification..

Hugh, computer hardware is the same for any operating system, you don't need a new CPU, its the windows software that is a problem, that comes in either 32 bit or 64 bit versions. You just need to install a windows 64 bit operating system rather than a 32 bit operating system. Your computer shop guy should be able to do that for you pretty cheaply if you are not confident doing it yourself. Make sure you tell him you already have a windows 7 licence & you just need the 64 bit operating system installed, activated & the drivers updated :lol: :lol:

Your computer will then also be able to access the full 8mb ram you have installed, plus windows 7 will better support the multiple cores your current CPU has. Like I said above, no new or additional hardware is required at all. Some extra memory would help with large bitmap files but won't make any difference at all with vector type graphics which don't use a lot of computer resources
<<

User avatar

Premium Member
Premium Member

Posts: 8534

Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2005 10:43 am

Country: United Kingdom (uk)




Post Fri Jul 21, 2017 10:05 am

Re: Help with new pc or Mac specification..

Martin Pearson wrote:Hugh, computer hardware is the same for any operating system, you don't need a new CPU, its the windows software that is a problem, that comes in either 32 bit or 64 bit versions. You just need to install a windows 64 bit operating system rather than a 32 bit operating system. Your computer shop guy should be able to do that for you pretty cheaply if you are not confident doing it yourself. Make sure you tell him you already have a windows 7 licence & you just need the 64 bit operating system installed, activated & the drivers updated :lol: :lol:

Your computer will then also be able to access the full 8mb ram you have installed, plus windows 7 will better support the multiple cores your current CPU has. Like I said above, no new or additional hardware is required at all. Some extra memory would help with large bitmap files but won't make any difference at all with vector type graphics which don't use a lot of computer resources



Hi Martin,
Maybe I'm getting the wrong end of the stick, are you saying my cpu will support 64 bit.. that it's the software that determines the number of bits? I have four Intel Core2 Quad cpu @2.40ghz listed in the system hardware, does that already support 64bit?...
<<

User avatar

2 Star Contributor

Posts: 170

Joined: Tue Jun 16, 2015 3:19 pm

Country: United Kingdom (uk)




Post Fri Jul 21, 2017 1:10 pm

Re: Help with new pc or Mac specification..

Hugh Potter wrote:
Martin Pearson wrote:Hugh, computer hardware is the same for any operating system, you don't need a new CPU, its the windows software that is a problem, that comes in either 32 bit or 64 bit versions. You just need to install a windows 64 bit operating system rather than a 32 bit operating system. Your computer shop guy should be able to do that for you pretty cheaply if you are not confident doing it yourself. Make sure you tell him you already have a windows 7 licence & you just need the 64 bit operating system installed, activated & the drivers updated :lol: :lol:

Your computer will then also be able to access the full 8mb ram you have installed, plus windows 7 will better support the multiple cores your current CPU has. Like I said above, no new or additional hardware is required at all. Some extra memory would help with large bitmap files but won't make any difference at all with vector type graphics which don't use a lot of computer resources



Hi Martin,
Maybe I'm getting the wrong end of the stick, are you saying my cpu will support 64 bit.. that it's the software that determines the number of bits? I have four Intel Core2 Quad cpu @2.40ghz listed in the system hardware, does that already support 64bit?...


A 64-bit OS (Operating System) will only run on a 64-bit hardware. That is 64-bit CPU installed on a compatible motherboard.
Most likely your old RAM won't be compatible with (newer) motherboards that supports 64-bit CPU but you have to check this.

Overall, if you want to switch to 64-bit, you need to start from scratch, you need a new computer. Your 32-bit old mate is obsolete.

If you want extra juice, get a SSD for OS and software and use old HDDs for storage on the same system.

You shouldn't need much graphic card unless you play games or you do video/3D rendering etc.
<<

User avatar

Premium Member
Premium Member

Posts: 8340

Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2002 1:00 am





Post Fri Jul 21, 2017 7:18 pm

Re: Help with new pc or Mac specification..

Hugh, don't take my word for it speak to your computer guy, if your computer has 8gb ram installed then it must support 64 bit operating system, no computer manufacturer is going to install 8gb ram in a machine that can only use about 3.5gb at best.
My machine is probably older than yours :lol: , it still does everything that I need it to & I don't sit about waiting for it complete tasks, if that were the case then I would build another one. My machine does have a higher spec than yours but if your machine isn't giving you to many problems just now then switching to windows 7 64 bit will show you a big increase in performance
<<

User avatar

Premium Member
Premium Member

Posts: 8534

Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2005 10:43 am

Country: United Kingdom (uk)




Post Fri Jul 21, 2017 8:07 pm

Re: Help with new pc or Mac specification..

Hi Martin,
It's defo 32bit. It only had 2x 4gb ram because that's what the shop had when one fried a few years back, overkill but I figured it would work them these hard that two 2gb!
<<

User avatar

3 Star Contributor

Posts: 299

Joined: Sat Sep 11, 2010 11:09 pm

Country: United Kingdom (uk)




Post Fri Jul 21, 2017 11:10 pm

Re: Help with new pc or Mac specification..

Set yourself a budget, if its £800 look at what you can get from Apple and look what you can get in a PC.

pound for pound you will get more machine in a PC. but it won't be as pretty but you will be able to upgrade it fairly easy in the future.

Apple has now started to solder everything to the motherboard, SSD and Graphics card and in the case of there laptops the processor and ram is soldered in.

I run both seamlessly, I have a desktop PC for design act and a PC for a rip PC and I carry a MacBook Pro for working from home etc. My desktop PC is at least 5x faster for half the price.

Buying second hand is OK for PC's as if something is goosed it won't cost the earth to repair, second hand Macs are another story,

Have a look here:

you would need a screen with this one but it has a decent graphics card which does most of the work with graphics programs and rendering.
https://www.aria.co.uk/Systems/Home+and ... ctId=67426

or this for just cpu power
https://www.aria.co.uk/Systems/Home+and ... ctId=68148

£1700 - £2200 if you chose the spec in an iMac

just my thoughts

Robert
<<

User avatar

1 Star Contributor

Posts: 88

Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 8:37 am

Country: United Kingdom (uk)




Post Sat Jul 22, 2017 11:52 am

Re: Help with new pc or Mac specification..

I spec every PC now with an SSD. It makes even slower running PCS a lot faster. So no matter what, I would get a minimum of a 256Mb SSD for the boot and programs drive. Add on a 1Tb minimum for storage if you need to (I use dropbox and NAS storage for files on the network)

Return to Computers



Who is online

Registered users:
Colin Bland

 

About
Contact
Board Rules
Membership
Terms & Conditions

 

Signapp - iPhone & iPad
Signapp - Android
Vehicle Wrap Training
Vinyl Application Training
Vehicle Wrap Accreditation
UK Sign Group
Site Membership
Advertising
Videos
British Signs & Graphics Assoc.

 

Facebook
Twitter
Youtube
Linkedin
Instagram
Pinterent

 

Who is Online

In total there are 61 users online ::
3 registered, 0 hidden and 58 guests
[based on past 5 minutes]

Most users ever online was
370 on Tue Aug 28, 2018 5:02 pm

Registered users:
Colin Bland

Copyright © 2000 - 2019 Robert Lambie