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Question on photo size / resolution for wall covering

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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 2:48 pm

Question on photo size / resolution for wall covering

Hi all,
A client wants for cover a few of the walls of his establishment. He has chosen various images form image libararies on the internet. One of the wall measures 9000mm x 2500mm. The image he has chosen for this wall is 10" x 6.7" @ 300dpi . will this image be suitable? what is the minimum I can expect to be able to use so it still looks good?
What advice to you give your clients about downwloading images for this purpose...
Thanks
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 3:03 pm

Might be something of help in this thread Clive?
https://www.uksignboards.com/viewtopic.php?t=57457
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 3:09 pm

Clive i'm no expert on digital print but there are a few things that make a difference from what I have read, firstly viewing distance makes a big difference to the resolution, further you are away the lower the resolution needs to be for it to look good.
Images at this sort of size are always going to be more difficult to get right but something that I know some on here use to scale up images is photozoom pro ( I know Shane uses it) Works far better than any of the image enlargement tools in programs such as photoshop.
When I have had to scale up a picture & wasn't sure if it would turn out alright I have scaled the image up to the size I required & then cropped & printed a very small bit of it just to check on quality.
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 3:43 pm

I normally like to have at least 100dpi at finished size but I'm not sure that is practical or necessary for the size you intend, Photozoom gets the thumbs up from me but just areminder that Photozoom V2 comes in Corel X5 and X6. Look in Photopaint under File - File format plugins - Export. If it isn't there you may need to install it as an extra from the Corel which may be a download but it is available to you
Alan d
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 4:07 pm

Where's Dave when you need him? :D
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 5:25 pm

2 things......

One Google allows you to search for an image size ergo, you can search for small images, medium or large, but you can also ask it to return images over a certain size for example 4 mega pixels.

If I'm searching for an image I need to use I always select the image size based on its application.

As a general rule of thumb, the maximum size an image needs to be is 72 dpi as long as its relative to the size of the application. The human eye only sees things at this resolution anyway.

So a 72 dpi image at an actual size of 1ft x 1ft will be ok up to that size, anything above that physical size will start to look pixelated at an average distance of 2 meters.

An image that is 1ft x 1ft but at 150 dpi can effectively be doubled in size without losing quality.

So your image of 10 inches at 300 dpi can be enlarged to approximately 4 times its original physical size without pixelating... so you could get it up to 40inches...... above that?... your in blur city.

Does that make sense?

Regards
BigMo
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 5:41 pm

sorry forgot to add.... the best way to check if an image is suitable is to enlarge it to the physical dimension you want in Photoshop or whatever program you use... then on your computer monitor, zoom in until the is says 100%. The image that you then see on your screen is how it will look to the naked eye regardless of what dpi it's set at..

See attached photos

Test One is at 150 dpi at a physical size of 50mm

Test Two is a crop of the same image at 500mm wide same resolution but both viewed at 100% of the size, ie the actual size you will view when printed at those dimensions.

Its also worth bearing in mind that Jpeg images will lose quality when saved and distributed or sent as files over time. Each time you re-save or send the image or copy and past, slowly it decreases in quality.

However PNG images always retain their original quality no matter how many times you move it around.

Of cource, vector files can be any size you need
Attachments
test two.jpg
test one.jpg
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 7:22 pm

So your image of 10 inches at 300 dpi can be enlarged to approximately 4 times its original physical size without pixelating... so you could get it up to 40inches...... above that?... your in blur city.


Sorry but I totally disagree. As an example, the attached image started the same size as Clive's original image and the finished print was 9.2m x 2.7m and was not blurred at all. If it was, the customer wouldn't hesitate to tell us to do it again !

John
Attachments
Untitled-2.jpg
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 7:25 pm

John Hughes wrote:
So your image of 10 inches at 300 dpi can be enlarged to approximately 4 times its original physical size without pixelating... so you could get it up to 40inches...... above that?... your in blur city.


Sorry but I totally disagree. As an example, the attached image started the same size as Clive's original image and the finished print was 9.2m x 2.7m and was not blurred at all. If it was, the customer wouldn't hesitate to tell us to do it again !

John


so your telling me a 10 inch image at 300 dpi has enlarged to that without blurring?

10 inches?......???

i think u may have your sums wrong because its impossible
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 7:33 pm

i think u may have your sums wrong because its impossible


I personally saw the email come through with the image attached.
I printed it on Mac Tac Deco satin
I cut the iamage up and finally
I fitted it.

The customer very happy !

NO I haven't got my sums wrong because it's there in real life !

John
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 7:36 pm

john... sorry mate but you cannot enlarge a 10 inch image at 300 dpi to 9 meters wide without blurring.... any chance i can see it close up?
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 7:43 pm

Thank you for all your replies!
John, your example looks pretty convincing. Do you have a closer photograph?
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 7:46 pm

john... sorry mate but you cannot enlarge a 10 inch image at 300 dpi to 9 meters wide without blurring.... any chance i can see it close up?


???? Well sorry if you don't believe me and without taking you there so you can look your probably not going to !

There are ways to achieve a good finished result without blurring which I would share but.........didn't you, on one post some time ago, call sign fitters 'Monkeys' !!

John
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 7:49 pm

This is a 1 inch physical size image at 300 dpi enlarged 12 times. This is how it will look to the eye when stood inside 2 meters from the image.

So this image is now one foot wide

I agree, over 3-4 meters away you will not see the blurring. But it will still be blurred close up.

You cant change the way this turns out... it's just not possible... maybe the image was a larger dpi

Unless there is some magic formula that I have missed in my 25 years of computer graphics and printing experience.... But if I have then please tell me because I would be on it in a heartbeat!
Attachments
300_dpi_X_12.jpg
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 7:50 pm

John, whats the secret to making it look good? is it by resampling?
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 7:54 pm

Hi Clive.

This is the only image I've got but cropped so I can bigger.

The white box at the bottom is an electrical socket so you can compare to the print. It looks great in real life with no blurring :D

John
Attachments
Untitled-2.jpg
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 7:55 pm

John Hughes wrote:
john... sorry mate but you cannot enlarge a 10 inch image at 300 dpi to 9 meters wide without blurring.... any chance i can see it close up?


???? Well sorry if you don't believe me and without taking you there so you can look your probably not going to !

There are ways to achieve a good finished result without blurring which I would share but.........didn't you, on one post some time ago, call sign fitters 'Monkeys' !!

John


Did I? care to point it out? Last time I looked I was a sign fitter too!
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 8:01 pm

maybe the image was a larger dpi


Ha....still don't believe me then !

As per my previous post.....just because I'm a Monkey (sign fitter) doesn't mean we can't achieve good results.

Clive...PM me.

John
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 8:04 pm

John Hughes wrote:
maybe the image was a larger dpi


Ha....still don't believe me then !

As per my previous post.....just because I'm a Monkey (sign fitter) doesn't mean we can't achieve good results.

Clive...PM me.

John


John I dont know what your problem is bus... but if you have an axe to grind... grind it with me in private, not public.


And as I said, show me the post!

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Is_there_anyw ... ts_quality
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 8:04 pm

Did I? care to point it out?


Yes you did, Am I going to search for it ? No!

But it was in relation to. that your there to run the business and that any monkey can fit signs.

John
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 8:24 pm

John I think you will find what I actually said was in context to someone asking me about business, I actually said that sticking a few bits of vinyl to a van doesn't qualify you as a fitter, any monkey can do that.

So, my apologies if you've misread what I had written, and I apologize if you have been offended in some way by my disagreeing with what you are saying.

However, personally I wouldn't be so immature as to try and discredit someone by mentioning what I had thought they had said about something completely random and off topic?

I wasn't suggesting you didn't know what you are doing, I merely pointed out what is factual. If you have found a way round it, then credit to you. Please don't take it so personally.

I Have no axe to grind with you.

All the best
BigMo
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 8:55 pm

I actually said that sticking a few bits of vinyl to a van doesn't qualify you as a fitter, any monkey can do that.


Sorry, I read that as people who fit signs to vans are basically monkeys.
I took offence to that comment as I'm one (not a monkey!).
Apologise I miss read it,

If you have found a way round it, then credit to you. Please don't take it so personally.


We have printed/fitted quite a few large images over the years with good results and whilst I admit there is a loss of quality, blurring is not a issue and the end result is good and customers happy.

Finally, I do take it personally, when someone disbelieves me plus it's my business and I take pride in it !

John
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 9:03 pm

John Hughes wrote:
I actually said that sticking a few bits of vinyl to a van doesn't qualify you as a fitter, any monkey can do that.


Sorry, I read that as people who fit signs to vans are basically monkeys.
I took offence to that comment as I'm one (not a monkey!).
Apologise I miss read it,

If you have found a way round it, then credit to you. Please don't take it so personally.


We have printed/fitted quite a few large images over the years with good results and whilst I admit there is a loss of quality, blurring is not a issue and the end result is good and customers happy.

Finally, I do take it personally, when someone disbelieves me plus it's my business and I take pride in it !

John


It's all cool John, thanks for coming back on that.... I wasn't discriminating your work, I'm sure you do a great job, and I applaud you for standing up for your workmanship. I'm glad that we cleared all that up.

Thank you

BigMo
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Post Thu Feb 28, 2013 10:38 pm

Sorted, And my axe is sharper :roll:

All the best.

John
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Post Wed Mar 27, 2013 2:09 pm

John Hughes wrote:Hi Clive.

This is the only image I've got but cropped so I can bigger.

The white box at the bottom is an electrical socket so you can compare to the print. It looks great in real life with no blurring :D

John

Don't want to get into an argument here but after looking at this photo I'm kind of on Mo's take on it.
That picture is taken quite away back and it still looks very blurry to me if you were close it would be badly pixelated.
For a high quality photo print I would try to use 75 -100 dpi actual size so a 10" (25mm) picture at 300dpi will only go to 1m wide at most.
That picture on the wall looks fine John as it is not a high definition print and the poster style suits what the customer wants, so as you say no problem there.
its all down to the desired effect/finish required and what you can get away with.

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