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Post Thu Jan 10, 2002 5:45 pm

Most of us i guess are at the helm of our own small businesses- are you all finding as we are that it is a constant battle to stay in business with the tax, vat, rent ,cars, maternity AND now GET THIS PATERNITY leave i have heard that men under new ec regs coming in that we have to give 2 weeks PAID leave what are the pratts going to do to us next perhaps we could pay for nappies for a year? we all want to help our staff but there is a limit as to how much we can take from this nanny state.We set off home so so depressed ... then get mugged in the bloody chippy! is it just me winging or are you all suffering-wasn't it so much easier when we worked for a gaffer?

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Subaru on 2002-01-10 16:47 ]</font>
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Post Fri Jan 11, 2002 1:21 am

Yes I agree Subaru.
When the minimum wage was introduced I over heard some of our fitters say.
?About time. Should have happened before now & stuff like that.? To an extent I agree, but they also said ? yes and its going up again soon also.? That will sort the employers out. Haha But I had to laugh at these guys. They all get a fairly good wage. What I said was ?if it keeps going up guys then your rises get lower. It?s as simple as that we can?t afford it. You have been working here. How many years? & Some kid that has never held a peace of vinyl in his life is walking in the door and getting what you all got in your 2nd year.? ?So I think you better start hoping it does not increase?.
We have around 14-16 staff. That?s a lot of wages for a small company.
I don?t know about all you but you would not believe the amount of 18-19 year olds that?s came to us for a month or 2 then never came back or had to be paid off because they just where not interested. You waste your money paying them. Just for them to waste half the jobs they touch. And if they haven?t got their hand in your back pocket there causing bother or not showing up for work. I know there are some good ones but finding them is damn hard!
I went to a college in Glasgow at the end of a term gave out 15 applications.
I ended up starting one out of all that applied. He was the best of a bad bunch.
But I thought at least if he went to sign college for a year or two then he must be interested. We gave him a decent pay & away he went. Handed him a load of small signs to letter on Foamex. Simple health and safety stuff. I left & came back 4-5 hours later. He had done 1 fire exit sign, and two 24?x24? boards with about 5 lines of text.
I asked him what the hell has kept him he said ?do you want it done right. Or do you want me to rush them and make a mistake.? You can imagine what I said.
What i am getting at is even in the colleges they are not preparing these guys for a busy working environment. They give them a sign to do and leave them for the rest of the day to get on with it. This way they are never going to be in a job. They are not prepared for a busy working environment.
I persevered with this guy for 3 month after that enough was enough.
I know this is not the main object of your post but like you have said this also makes life hard when trying to earn a living.
Amongst all the day-to-day hassles & customers not paying?.
Hey forget the buying group? why don?t we all merge and start one big sign company?all specialising in there own field?

Just kidding?.
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Post Fri Jan 11, 2002 5:46 am

thanks for a very in depth reply Robert. I have also experienced all the same problems- the degree of training today is sadly lacking there is no sense of purpose in today's available workforces there are exceptions but generally they just want the pay and "old fashioned" committment is out of the window. My theory on the youth of today is that they hit life's peak far too early ie 8-14 years old they have got all lifes trinkets by the time they reach puberty and making a living in life is a most unwelcome prospect once they loose their viginity at 12!!- likely these days- life as we know it is a bore!! drugs or crime or both is a better way of making a living or making the lives of employers hell vandalism is more fun than getting up for work- my workshop is regularly attacked by young brainless thugs--- guys please send lots of postings on this subject it must provoke you all into action as we are all just commercial pawns in Tb's game of international chess! unpaid tax collectors- cannon fodder for Mr chancellor how are things in the USA Ireland and Canada? look forward to sharing our thoughts and problems Steve Subaru

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Subaru on 2002-01-11 04:49 ]</font>
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Post Fri Jan 11, 2002 9:17 pm

well i suppose you can blame the state of current signmaking courses on the british sign association, they are a governing body and i think that they help set the course units and the elements involved in it.......

just to look at the content is frightning and they really should look at what the colleges are teaching, most of the kids have never seen a piece of plastic

they should pay me a big fat wage and i will set the courses
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Post Sat Jan 12, 2002 11:37 am

Hi Davi interesting reply- please list the main elements of your signmakers teaching package.Where would the teaching start and end? what does the modern signmaker need to know?.....
Do they, as i was taught all those years ago at art school, need to be able to marble and gloss a panel to glass like finish do they need to know about Mr Caxton? given that your salary for teacing it was fat enough could you instill some idea of what the present working environment is like would they give a toss? the teachers just do not know enough about their subject teachers at my college in Bradford were misters they knew all there was to know about the then sign trade it was all crafted by hand now that was skill! whats hard about today's industry survival! getting paid! years ago people acted responsibly in business it was a matter of honour to do a job properly and you would be paid immediately not so now 60 days is good!
somebody move this bloody soapbox lol !!!
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Post Sun Jan 13, 2002 3:45 pm

I'm fast approaching the big 40 (163 days to go bugger!) hee hee I started work at a printers when i left school and have worked for a variety of businesses before becoming self employed and the thing i remember most when i started out at 16 was the fact that if i didn't do what i was told i didn't get paid and if i gobbed off too much i got a smack in the mouth! ~I remember my grandad saying how we kids had it too easy, he should see the useless little idiots we are churning out today.
But who's fault is it, well first up we could blame that grinning MORON and his like in Westminster then the teachers then maybe its societies fault. B*LL*X we just give them too much stuff too easily DVD's Playstations, computers, one kid I know gets 20 quid a week pocket money and he's 12.
We are raising a nation of Disrespectful, lazy, wimps.
Theres an add on TV from SONY I think featuring an empty TV box which basically is saying the kids would rather sit in front of the TV than use their imagination and play with the box.
We have got to sort them out ourselves chuck away all the stuff that can be pluggged in and give e'm a box of lego. LOL rant over I'm going back to reading Bleak House.

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