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Brian Little

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Post Sun Oct 18, 2009 10:03 pm

lost driving license

no not me !!!!! its my boy marc. it must be e record really he past his test on the wednesday and was done for speeding a week later. great all that hard work and expence down the swanny.hed done everything wrong from the start racing his mates up the motorway at one o'clock in the morning . Apart from the lecture i gave him about killing himself and his friends he will know dought get a ban have to resit his test and a fine ...what a disaster .im know angel ive been done myself over the years but 103 mph is a no no .He was one of three cars marc was the middle car and the police came along side of hime and pulled him in . Thats the bit im kinda struggling with to be honest they say that he was doing 103......but his friend in the car in front buggered off and the police asked marc to phone him and get him back to the scene . Marc has only got a wee 106 pug it would be struggling to get to that speed in such a short time from the roundabout .Marcs convinced he was only doing about ninty .Im not looking for an excuse . but it could be the differnce between points and a licence lost
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Post Sun Oct 18, 2009 10:24 pm

well, l hope he will learn from his experience Brian,
And better to be alive without a license than dead with one.

I was banned before I even got my license, indeed before I was old enough to drive! which really did make me think about behaving in a car when I eventually passed my test, a year after I wanted to at 18.
Ninety is not fast, speed does not kill, like falling from a height doesn't, its the abrupt stop that does the damage....

Peter
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Nigel Hindley

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Post Sun Oct 18, 2009 10:53 pm

Re: lost driving license

Brian Little wrote:no not me !!!!! its my boy marc. it must be e record really he past his test on the wednesday and was done for speeding a week later. great all that hard work and expence down the swanny.hed done everything wrong from the start racing his mates up the motorway at one o'clock in the morning . Apart from the lecture i gave him about killing himself and his friends he will know dought get a ban have to resit his test and a fine ...what a disaster .im know angel ive been done myself over the years but 103 mph is a no no .He was one of three cars marc was the middle car and the police came along side of hime and pulled him in . Thats the bit im kinda struggling with to be honest they say that he was doing 103......but his friend in the car in front buggered off and the police asked marc to phone him and get him back to the scene . Marc has only got a wee 106 pug it would be struggling to get to that speed in such a short time from the roundabout .Marcs convinced he was only doing about ninty .Im not looking for an excuse . but it could be the differnce between points and a licence lost


Like Peter says Brian - possibly for the best? you cant pass your test and drive like this for long without something very serious going wrong.
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Brian Little

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Post Sun Oct 18, 2009 10:54 pm

ive got mixed feelings about it peter . In a way i hope he is banned. I love my son but the thought of him being killed and taking someone elses son or daughter doesnt bare thinking about .Two Dats after this he falls off his bike during the day and fractures his arm.......what does marc do ? ...wel rather than phone me or his mum he drives with one arm while his friend changes the gears :( imagine if the same traffic officer stopped him on that occasion !!! I dont know what it is about him i love him to bits but hes like so many other lads of that age they seem to have a death wish
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Phill Fenton

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Post Sun Oct 18, 2009 11:06 pm

Sorry to hear this Brian - and I don't know what the answer is.

In my day any car we could get hold of would struggle to do 60 or 70. Nowadays, a ten year old scrapper is capable of 100mph which is why so many youngsters find it hard to afford insurance. I know from my own experience when I was 17 if I had a car capable of 100mph I would have tried driving it at that speed. When you're that age you really do believe you are indestructible, so I can't blame todays kids for being any different.

My daughter crashed her car in the summer but was unhurt in the incident. In fact I think it probably taught her (and my son) a valuable lesson.

I'm glad Marc is safe and well - perhaps losing his licence will teach him a hard lesson - but not as hard as it could have been (thank goodness).
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Post Sun Oct 18, 2009 11:53 pm

Phill
you must be really old, when I was in my teens lots of cars did the ton!
I had a 3 litre capri for a short time, before being told I was not insured.
But speed is relevant to the safety of the car, nowadays most people would survive a 50mph crash without serious injury, whereas in the sixties, when I was in my teens, a 50mph crash would almost certainly have been fatal.
I got my leg smashed when I was 20, and after getting out of hospital,
drove my mg midget using a crutch to press the brake pedal!

so nothing changes.

Most of us survive our stupidity, and if we are one of the lucky ones, benefit from our mistakes.
that's part of the learning curve of life.

Marc does not have a death wish, like mentioned above,
we are all invincible when we are young

Brian
Worry you will, but your son will go his own way, all you can do is hope he makes the best of things
Peter
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Phill Fenton

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Post Mon Oct 19, 2009 8:54 am

Peter Normington wrote:Phill
you must be really old, when I was in my teens lots of cars did the ton!


I was talking about the sort of cars I was able to get my hands on - typically clapped out old Minis and Beetles that despite having four cylinders usually only ran on three :-?
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Karl Williams

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Post Mon Oct 19, 2009 10:36 am

Yes it's dangerous and stupid. But we all abuse the freedom a driving licence gives us in the early days. When he gets his licence back I'm sure he'll think twice before giving the car a blast. Now if it was drink driving that's a different matter. Lets hope he never tries that one.
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Brian Little

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Post Mon Oct 19, 2009 10:53 am

thank you my friends...and your right ..he well deserves to loose it if anything comes out of this positive its me .....ive really slowed down!! i was an offender myself :( ive never owned such a quick car but the thought of loosing my liscence or worse taking someone out ...id never live with myself nor should i . When i was lecturing marc his obvious answer was ""hey dad you cant talk you got done for speeding years ago " The fact is i was kinda hoping along the lines i want him to be better than me not as dumb. He was very polite to the police when stopped ...hmm im kinda hoping that was in his favour....its what id expect from him..aww well such is life



PS PETER COME ON THE ONLY CAR ON THE BLOCK IN MY DAYS LATE SEVENTYS WAS THE 2.8 CAPRI not the 3 litre



:D :D :D :D
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Ian Johnston

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Post Mon Oct 19, 2009 10:58 am

Re: lost driving license

Brian Little wrote:no not me !!!!! its my boy marc. it must be e record really he past his test on the wednesday and was done for speeding a week later. great all that hard work and expence down the swanny.hed done everything wrong from the start racing his mates up the motorway at one o'clock in the morning . Apart from the lecture i gave him about killing himself and his friends he will know dought get a ban have to resit his test and a fine ...what a disaster .im know angel ive been done myself over the years but 103 mph is a no no .He was one of three cars marc was the middle car and the police came along side of hime and pulled him in . Thats the bit im kinda struggling with to be honest they say that he was doing 103......but his friend in the car in front buggered off and the police asked marc to phone him and get him back to the scene . Marc has only got a wee 106 pug it would be struggling to get to that speed in such a short time from the roundabout .Marcs convinced he was only doing about ninty .Im not looking for an excuse . but it could be the differnce between points and a licence lost


If the above is true he will get off,
The police have no way of detecting his speed if he's the middle car, they can only detect one car, and assume that your son was doing the same.

What is the manufactures top speed of the car, 1.0cc 106 is about 93mph.

Get a solicitor he'll get off,

It happened to me, 102mph in a 1.0 Fiat uno, Got off without a fine, as the manufacture top speed was 90mph, therefore not possible, ( Even thought it would actually do 110mph :D )
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Post Mon Oct 19, 2009 11:15 am

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Brian Little

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Post Mon Oct 19, 2009 11:25 am

Re: lost driving license

Ian Johnston wrote:
Brian Little wrote:no not me !!!!! its my boy marc. it must be e record really he past his test on the wednesday and was done for speeding a week later. great all that hard work and expence down the swanny.hed done everything wrong from the start racing his mates up the motorway at one o'clock in the morning . Apart from the lecture i gave him about killing himself and his friends he will know dought get a ban have to resit his test and a fine ...what a disaster .im know angel ive been done myself over the years but 103 mph is a no no .He was one of three cars marc was the middle car and the police came along side of hime and pulled him in . Thats the bit im kinda struggling with to be honest they say that he was doing 103......but his friend in the car in front buggered off and the police asked marc to phone him and get him back to the scene . Marc has only got a wee 106 pug it would be struggling to get to that speed in such a short time from the roundabout .Marcs convinced he was only doing about ninty .Im not looking for an excuse . but it could be the differnce between points and a licence lost


If the above is true he will get off,
The police have no way of detecting his speed if he's the middle car, they can only detect one car, and assume that your son was doing the same.

What is the manufactures top speed of the car, 1.0cc 106 is about 93mph.

Get a solicitor he'll get off,

It happened to me, 102mph in a 1.0 Fiat uno, Got off without a fine, as the manufacture top speed was 90mph, therefore not possible, ( Even thought it would actually do 110mph :D )




Hi ian this is the part that has me baffled .Marc was in the middle car his friend was way about three car lengths ahead . marc says that he saw the t5 volvo of the police coming up beside him and telling him to pull over .his friend in the front car didnt stopped .The police asked marc to phone his friend to get him back to the scene as things were only going to get worse .His two friends in the front and rear cars had there cars impounded because they both had asbos for loud music in thee cars from previous occasions .Marc has nothing like that so got to keep his car .hmmm weird. His wee car is a 1.4 pug quicksilver ive looked it up it does 109 top speed but know dought that was when it was new ....and going up a hill.hmmm marc reckons he wasnt doing that ive know reason to dought him. The other lads have had letter through the door Marc has had nothing so far
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Karl Williams

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Post Mon Oct 19, 2009 11:33 am

Re: lost driving license

When or if paperwork comes through the door write back and request photographic evidence of the offence. But you have to ask yourself if he gets off will he think he's untouchable? And so will he do it again and next time kill someone? Let him take the punishment so he can realise the stupity of his antics. Harsh I know but if it stops him from killing someone next time it's got to be worth it.
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Ian Johnston

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Post Mon Oct 19, 2009 11:34 am

the best thing you could do for him is to get him involved in his local motorclub. I used to be crazy, Now i navigate in rally's, its no fun going hard on the road as the buzz in a rally car is 500% better,

All the local boy racers get invited to take part in our club events, they soon find out they not that good
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Brian Little

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Post Mon Oct 19, 2009 11:45 am

Ian Johnston wrote:the best thing you could do for him is to get him involved in his local motorclub. I used to be crazy, Now i navigate in rally's, its no fun going hard on the road as the buzz in a rally car is 500% better,

All the local boy racers get invited to take part in our club events, they soon find out they not that good



thanks ian ill look into that theres courses in rallying at knockhill neer us . yip i digress from my subject a bit but rallying does it for me to .I remmember (old man talking here) Jimmy macrae rallying for SMT in perth at the time i was an apprentice signwriter 77 ..it was the dealerteam vauxhalls remmember them !!we used to signwrite them .Jimmy used to bring Colin in to the garage when he was up .ahh memorys...right old man has stopped now ...im only 48 youd think i was sixty :D
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Phill Fenton

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Post Mon Oct 19, 2009 10:35 pm

Brian Little wrote:PS PETER COME ON THE ONLY CAR ON THE BLOCK IN MY DAYS LATE SEVENTYS WAS THE 2.8 CAPRI not the 3 litre


The 2.8 injection was not introduced until 1981 - I think you nust have imagined seeing them in the late 70's Brian. I know this cos I'm a bit of an anorak when it comes to Capris :-?
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DavidRogers

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Post Mon Oct 19, 2009 11:20 pm

Feel for you Brian - your dilemma.

Most of us who have / have had quick cars appreciate (obviously through wild speculation and trackdays) that 100 isn't fast...120 isn't that fast and it only get a bit 'twitchy' at "near the end of the speedo" speeds for most 'competent' drivers in a non-race prepared car.

On the other hand - 80 in an early 1.0 fiesta or panda can feel like the space shuttle on re-entry.

Young lads in frankly 'boy racer' cars running near the ragged edge in terms of speed, handling, braking & competency should have the consequences just like any of the rest of us. If I was caught doing silly speeds...I'd just have to 'fair cop'...and take it like a man.

On the plus side he was compliant...may well go a long way into them logging that as the only offence (speeding) and not pressing for 'racing on a public highway' or ' dangerous driving'.

As for the legality of the 103 - it will stand 99% of the time...unless you are the police, MP or premiership footballer...

The WORD of a SINGLE traffic officer can and will be used as evidence as an EXPERT opinion. Also - VASCAR uses the simple time v distance to log speeds no need for radar or laser cameras. They simply need to start the camera / timer as the 'offender' passes a landmark or painted square on the road - and a known distance later - stop the timer...result is the speed.

Unless you have a good lawyer, a few £ and are prepared to pay for experts to tear the car to bits to PROVE it was 100% standard and incapable of the speeds...and if it's found to be not standard - face further prosecution for invalid (ie. NO) insurance if any 'undeclared performance related items' are found.

Can o' worms.

30+ over the limit is pretty much a guaranteed court appearance. NOT necessarily a ban.

Scottish courts tend to be harsher than our southern cousins with less instances of the 'hardship' plea appealing to the law's sense of compassion.

Oh, yeh. Still got 0 points...although pulled twice for speeding.

36 in a 30 (on pushbike) and 71mph on the DC to Aberdeen (overtook the traffic car)...in a '60' rated van! Yes sir, no sir....very sorry...didn't realise...

Let us know how it goes.

ps. was he given a N.I.P at the time?
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Brian Little

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Post Tue Oct 20, 2009 8:05 am

Phill wrote:
Brian Little wrote:PS PETER COME ON THE ONLY CAR ON THE BLOCK IN MY DAYS LATE SEVENTYS WAS THE 2.8 CAPRI not the 3 litre


The 2.8 injection was not introduced until 1981 - I think you nust have imagined seeing them in the late 70's Brian. I know this cos I'm a bit of an anorak when it comes to Capris :-?




hmm im away ahead of my time Phill :D :D ...it was either that or the rs 2000 Perth was a flood of these cars in there day never see any of them now ....i seem to remember that the later ones had a limited slip diff for better handling..could be wrong there to
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Brian Little

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Post Tue Oct 20, 2009 8:14 am

David Rogers wrote:Feel for you Brian - your dilemma.

Most of us who have / have had quick cars appreciate (obviously through wild speculation and trackdays) that 100 isn't fast...120 isn't that fast and it only get a bit 'twitchy' at "near the end of the speedo" speeds for most 'competent' drivers in a non-race prepared car.

On the other hand - 80 in an early 1.0 fiesta or panda can feel like the space shuttle on re-entry.

Young lads in frankly 'boy racer' cars running near the ragged edge in terms of speed, handling, braking & competency should have the consequences just like any of the rest of us. If I was caught doing silly speeds...I'd just have to 'fair cop'...and take it like a man.


yip Dave 99% of me says tuff ......hes done the crime do the time he deeserves it . On the other hand hes my son above all and i would like to help him as much as i can .marc was polite to the police and it wa noted by them. im glad ive done something right as a parent mabe that ill go in his favour. One of his friends was lippy you know the "youll never take me alive copper syndrome " which is never a good idea. Anyway Dave heres hoping

On the plus side he was compliant...may well go a long way into them logging that as the only offence (speeding) and not pressing for 'racing on a public highway' or ' dangerous driving'.

As for the legality of the 103 - it will stand 99% of the time...unless you are the police, MP or premiership footballer...

The WORD of a SINGLE traffic officer can and will be used as evidence as an EXPERT opinion. Also - VASCAR uses the simple time v distance to log speeds no need for radar or laser cameras. They simply need to start the camera / timer as the 'offender' passes a landmark or painted square on the road - and a known distance later - stop the timer...result is the speed.

Unless you have a good lawyer, a few £ and are prepared to pay for experts to tear the car to bits to PROVE it was 100% standard and incapable of the speeds...and if it's found to be not standard - face further prosecution for invalid (ie. NO) insurance if any 'undeclared performance related items' are found.

Can o' worms.

30+ over the limit is pretty much a guaranteed court appearance. NOT necessarily a ban.

Scottish courts tend to be harsher than our southern cousins with less instances of the 'hardship' plea appealing to the law's sense of compassion.

Oh, yeh. Still got 0 points...although pulled twice for speeding.

36 in a 30 (on pushbike) and 71mph on the DC to Aberdeen (overtook the traffic car)...in a '60' rated van! Yes sir, no sir....very sorry...didn't realise...

Let us know how it goes.

ps. was he given a N.I.P at the time?
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John Childs

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Post Tue Oct 20, 2009 9:38 am

Ahhh, children. Brought into this world to give parents a hard time. :D

Well, whether he was doing ninety, or into three figures, doesn't really matter. He was deliberately speeding and should be told to take the consequences.

As for lesson learned - I don't see it. There was no accident and nobody got hurt (thankfully) so the only real lesson he will learn is not to get caught next time.

If it does end up in court the best advice I can offer is to plead guilty, say that he's sorry, that it won't happen again, and then keep his mouth firmly shut. Absolutely anything he tries to say in mitigation will make him sound like a right plonker when read in the local evening paper. :D

added on edit: Sorry if the above makes me sound like a smug, holier than thou, pedant. I'm not really, honest, and will happily speed with the best of them when circumstances permit. But when I get caught, and I'm bound to sooner or later, I will be quite happy to take my medicine.
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John Harding

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Post Tue Oct 20, 2009 9:54 am

PS PETER COME ON THE ONLY CAR ON THE BLOCK IN MY DAYS LATE SEVENTYS WAS THE 2.8 CAPRI not the 3 litre


sorry Brian personally i'm with peter on this one - I had a 3.0s JPS original much classier than the 2.8i :D

John
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Brian Little

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Post Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:44 pm

John Harding wrote:
PS PETER COME ON THE ONLY CAR ON THE BLOCK IN MY DAYS LATE SEVENTYS WAS THE 2.8 CAPRI not the 3 litre


sorry Brian personally i'm with peter on this one - I had a 3.0s JPS original much classier than the 2.8i :D

John






hmm John mabe i was seeing life thru rose tinted spectacles in those days i always thought the 2.8 was the dogs "~~~~~~~~~" in those days silver and light met blue on the top i think most of them were that colur although there was a few in black if my memory servs me well

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