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Huge potential, but partner is not wanting to budge!!:(

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Post Thu Mar 27, 2003 1:06 pm

Huge potential, but partner is not wanting to budge!!:(

Hello again folks.

I need all the input i can get from you overseas guys. I've been in the sign business for approx. 4 yrs with things going pretty good. Mostly doing whatever it takes to pay the bills. I operate a small shop in a small town so getting rich quick is out of the question. Anyway, about my problem. A local business and friend of mine wanted me to a job for him which consisted of a College football team logo, which was copyrighted. And of course i did it for him. Well to make a long story short, we did a (few) and somehow, someway we got ratted out. A certified letter came shortly later stating that The CLC(Collegiate Licensing Company) was aware of or ILLEGAL manufacturing of their logos, and we must stop or ELSE. So of course we did. Before the letter was recieved I had already sent a prototype of what we wanted to license, for the CLC to review. And guess what?? They loved it. Its not on the market. And we are one form away from having an officially licensed collegiate product. Now my problem is my parnter. He has loads and loads of money, and his business has contacts throughout the states which will make our licensing a huge suceess. (His money and contacts is why we partnered together for this new company) Anyhow now im stuck. To really make this happen, either we sub-contract the manufacturing of these logos, or we buy a gerber-edge package($18,000.00 is the special right now) He really doesnt understand why we cant do the logos with just a cutter(that i have)
Which I have explained to him that me cutting and installing onto the finished product for his business was a piece of cake, but to mass-produce these 6 or 7 color decals for shipping was imposibble and profit would be so low wouldnt be worht while. I need advice from this point. I finally have an opportunity of a lifetime, and hate to stop at this point. $20,000 grand isnt a lot, but by myself, the Im completly tied up at the bank. How can i convince him to go foward or should i just sub-contract this out and lose all the profits. Sorry this was so long, but as you can tell im really stressing. Thanks again guys for this board!!

Rule #1 The customer is always right.
Rule # 2 This aint Burger King, you can have it your way but custom work takes time. :-?
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Post Thu Mar 27, 2003 1:10 pm

I need all the input i can get from you overseas guys


We are not overseas......


You are :roll:
________
Mercedes-benz vario specifications
Last edited by Chalkie on Thu Feb 24, 2011 1:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post Thu Mar 27, 2003 1:22 pm

...find someone with a gerber edge and TALK TO THEM!...

I don't mean work out a 'good price' either - I mean TALK TO THEM.

Most independant signmakers are in the same boat at one level or another and if they can help they will...

There's always someone out there thinking; "I've just bought this Edge and now I have to make sure it earns its keep...if only someone wanted a regular supply just for a few months til' I get on my feet..." etc. This isn't taking advantage either, it's just the way business works.

I would try to find someone sympathetic and eager (new) to help and then, when you've done a few thousand of these stickers and made a few dollars each then move on and get your won machine...in this way everyone wins.

good luck - don't bite off more than you can chew - sorry to say but you must always consider the 'worst-case scenario' so in the way I've described no-one takes any chances and no-one losses their pants if it all goes belly-up! Some might see this as the 'little guy's way of doing it'...but I'm a great believer in the old phrase..."slowly, slowly catchy monkey!" :wink:

more soon

mike
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Post Thu Mar 27, 2003 1:45 pm

good point

Thanks for your input mike.

I kinda wanted to be maybe the one with the edge looking to help others
as you discussed, but will keep your idea in mind!!

And Chalkie...... Im always amazed at someone as brilliant as you :)

Sean
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Post Thu Mar 27, 2003 2:43 pm

Have you considered screenprinting these instead?

I'm no expert, but I would have thought that if you were planning to mass produce a single design - then the Gerber Edge is probably not the most cost effective way to do it anyway?

I am led to believe that screen printing is not that difficult or expensive to set up. However, Lorraine is probably the one to best advise you about this.
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Post Thu Mar 27, 2003 6:46 pm

I once worked for a company producing all of kodaks signs, there were five of us, one sales director(he looked after kodak and did the odd survey), one managing director, (we only saw him once or twice a month the rest of the time he played on his farm..??)a secretary and two production staff, (me and one other). Fitting was subded out.
In 18 months trading, before we went ****-up our sales were £489,000. In the first 6 months we trade from the factory we had all been made redundant paying very little or no rent, using scrap perspex and other materials, only buying the occasional ally box. (very high profit margins of at least 70% - 80%)
I was given the opportunity to take over the work, (as this company was going bust) I talked it over with the other production staff and i looked for factory unit's getting a good deal from one council 6 months rent free etc. He wouldn't take the risk, and as i didn't have that much money, and didn't have time to train a new person to do the work (Kodak are quite particular about the way their signs are laid out) I missesd the boat. somthing i have always regretted, as i know it would have been a great sucsess.

My advise Go for it, sub-out the work until you have the capital to invest in equipment to do it all in house.
Maybe once your partner sees how much money could be maked he will agree to the needed machinery.
Or get a bank loan and go it alone .
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Post Thu Mar 27, 2003 7:01 pm

Hi Sean,

Don’t be too hard on this partner of yours. He’s made loads and loads of money as you put it, no doubt by using his own judgment, and is not willing risk $18,000 on your judgment that is yet unproven.
Perhaps by using Phill’s suggestion (if possible) of screen printing at a much lower cost, you could persuaded your partner to come onboard. Then if you can prove yourself with this project you may find it easer to get the backing you require in the future.

Good luck, and I hope you find a solution.
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Post Thu Mar 27, 2003 7:27 pm

As far as the screen-printing is concerned. Inexpensive? Not if you don't have the space needed to house all the supplies etc. etc. as well as EPA standards. Becuase we have so many designs, we need to be able to do muti-license products. The edge is small with fast output. As Simon Signage says, he has his regrets, I'm sure a lot of you do. The licensing company stated that "Less than 20% of applications get accepted."
That for 1 has got me geared up and ready. Im 26 years old and really have never had such an opportunity. Other manufacture would work, BUT more forms,insurance requiremnets, and a bunch of B.S. And the fact that this is almost like a patend idea, not quite but close. As I stated in an earlier post, this is a New Product!!! I KNOW of quite a few companies out there that are going to be in "Shock & Awe" once this hits the market, hopefully by end of April. As a last resort, could gather another investor. One more note, Be extra carefull with copyrighted designs. Companies will prosecute. Trust me on that one!! :lol:

Thanks again all ya'll( you all) overseas folks
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Post Thu Mar 27, 2003 7:37 pm

Why not try and convince him to purchase a secondhand/used gerber-edge then if things dont work out you should be able to sell it again for approx what you paid for it, if it works out you can always trade it in for a new one at a later date.

regards steve
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Post Thu Mar 27, 2003 9:36 pm

You say there are multiple designs.. But surely this is limited to 3-6 a little more even.
If this were the case I would still go for the screen-printing idea. See how if it works, and if it does and the same
Prospect is still staring you in the face. Use what you have made so far from the screen prints and invest in the edge.
$18000 may not sound a lot compared to the return, but it’s enough to easily sink a small company if your guess is “wrong” if it is, you may loss that partner, your business & maybe even more…
Tread careful.. :roll:
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Post Thu Mar 27, 2003 9:48 pm

If it is such a good idea, then you must go for it!

In the Uk, Spandex, which is now owned by Gerber, will sell you an Edge for no deposit, on a five year lease option. This is your best option of getting your hands on a brand new one. Surely you have a similar offer locally?

Alternatively, if the product is so unqiue, then you should be able to sell it at a premium. This should enable you to build in a manufacturing cost which has been farmed out. If not, then it is probably not as good an idea as you think!

Business is all about taking risks, but at the same time covering your ( oh i swore ). Get some independent advise from an accountant.

good luck!!

Rocky Raccoon
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Post Thu Mar 27, 2003 10:15 pm

Good point richard.. but are you not then tied to the lease agreement over that period? :roll:
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Post Thu Mar 27, 2003 11:51 pm

To be frank - If you can't convince your partner who "has loads of money" anyway - then I think you're going to have a very difficult job to convince any other investor to back you.

Why is your partner unwilling to go along with this? You must ask yourself if this idea really is such a viable business deal after all, or is your judgement being clouded by your enthusiasm.

Having said that, and having discounted other methods of production (after considering them seriously) , I would say that If the Gerber Edge is the only way you have of realising your dream, and you can hand on heart say you have looked at this in a totally impartial way - yet you are still convinced that this is the opportunity of a lifetime - then you must go for it.

$18000 is not a lot to invest (sell your granny - or as a last resort your car if you have to) . For a signmaker, this machine is a very worthwhile addition to your armoury (even if your business idea does not work out - you will certainly find many uses for the Edge anyway).

What troubles me is why you are asking our opinion anyway if you are already convinced about the viability of this idea.

Reading between the lines I suspect you have your own doubts, or there is some other motive behind this.
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Post Fri Mar 28, 2003 2:02 am

Maybe I just wrote the worng caption. For the answer to the last reply. I asked the guys here for their opinons. I thought that was the whole purpose of this bord. General Discussion from fellows in the trade. Thanks for all the input, and ill be sure to let all you know when production rolls!!

Later

Sean
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Post Sat May 24, 2003 1:27 am

jassgraphix wrote:I KNOW of quite a few companies out there that are going to be in "Shock & Awe" once this hits the market, hopefully by end of April. As a last resort, could gather another investor. One more note, Be extra carefull with copyrighted designs. Companies will prosecute. Trust me on that one!! :lol:

Thanks again all ya'll( you all) overseas folks


It's now the middle of May - Where is the shock and awe (?)

(come to think of it - where are the weapons of mass destruction :roll: )
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Post Sat May 24, 2003 6:49 pm

Shock & Awe

for your knowledge

We just finished our licensing agreement last week. Now comes the fun.
Go getcha a licensing agreement. Call me when you get finished with those 1000's of forms,requirements, royalities, etc.etc.
We made the grade!!!!

For those other companies, be on the lookout.

Later guys

Sean

www.cartartinc.com

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